Ingka Group's Jesper Brodin: The talent crisis you’re not talking enough about

This transcript, generated from speech recognition technology, has been edited for web readers, condensed for clarity, and may differ slightly from the audio.

Jesper Brodin: It's about getting to know people, getting to understand what they're made of, what they're dreaming of and, for those who have an opportunity to be decision makers, to not over intellectualise it. To make some trials, make some tests, and see how you actually can learn and benefit from the richness of diversity.

Linda Lacina: Welcome to Meet the Leader, a podcast where top leaders share how they're tackling the world's toughest challenges. Today's leader: Jesper Brodin. He's the Chief Executive Officer of Ingka Group, the main owner and operator of IKEA retail. He'll talk about the employment crisis you haven't heard enough about - the one impacting millions of refugees and displaced people around the world.

Subscribe to Meet the Leader on Apple, Spotify and wherever you get your favourite podcasts. And please take a moment to rate and review us. I'm Linda Lacina from the World Economic Forum, and this is Meet The Leader.

Jesper Brodin: Always working at a distance creates a new form of emptiness and a new form of loneliness, while we are looking for practical ways of working in the future.

Linda Lacina: It's January, and at the World Economic Forum that can mean just one thing: Davos.

This massive meeting of world leaders, business people and global organizations meets for the first time in January since 2020, since before COVID. This year's theme: Cooperation in a fragmented world. As leaders need to navigate a continuing pandemic as well as economic shifts and geopolitical disruptions.

In other words, the theme of this year's Davos, and any Davos, is that it's possible to be part of the solution, and we'll learn today how Ingka Group's Skills for Employment Initiative will show us how.

In a world with more than 100 million forcibly displaced people, the holding company for IKEA, one of the world's biggest retailers, has created a programme that connects those who have fled war, violence and terror with a better start to their new lives.

The Skills for Employment Initiative provides three to six months of training to help refugees and asylum seekers around the world find meaningful work, either at IKEA or other companies.

It has also developed a special toolkit to help other companies understand what steps they need to take to meet the needs of displaced people in the communities they serve and adapt their hiring, training and other priorities.

When refugees and displaced people resettle, they find they've traded chaos for the uncertainty of unemployment. They face rejection, language barriers and mounds of red tape. Sometimes they don't have the skills needed to get hired in their new home. And in short, this group of workers, some of the most loyal once hired, just can't find work.

During UN week last September, Jesper BrodIn, the Chief Executive Officer at Ingka Group, talked to me about the 1,700 people in 24 countries the programme has already helped. He also explained how programmes like this one play an important role in everything from tackling labour shortages and strengthening economies to helping leaders re-examine their recruiting approaches, helping them be more inclusive, less slow and maybe even less bias towards certain types of profiles.

And though remote work has been grabbing the headlines, most work is still in person. And people in programmes like this one can help leaders consider new ways of developing teams in a physical space.

It's one of the many ways that we can cooperate in a fragmented world and a fitting conversation to have ahead of Davos.

Jesper Brodin will talk about all of this, but first he'll ground us on the Skills for Employment Initiative, what it is and why it's so important.

Jesper Brodin: Not many people know that IKEA is today owned by a foundation. So, we are foundation-based, and the IKEA Foundation is deeply engaged in people and planet topics. More and more we have seen over the years how these two topics are totally intertangled.

IKEA Foundation was engaged in the consequences of the war in Syria. Immediate refuge tents, survival was basically part of what we did together with UNHCR and other organizations. But in the aftermath, we then were invited to discuss how do we contribute in the next phase of a humanitarian catastrophe.

Then we saw the need of providing jobs for people as one of the next steps. For dignity, for self-confidence, and actually for bringing people out of an acute situation into a dignified life. Sol we were engaged then from a business perspective also to see how do we actually show up and support.

We set up a project. We recruited about 300 women to this — it sounds easy, it wasn't — but with the help of Jordan River Foundation and the authorities in Jordan, we were capable to develop what later became a concept. So, we brought this concept back to Europe and said: How do we reflect society in every community we are, and of course, in Europe today, more or less every nation, every market, every city, has a refugee situation, an immigrant situation. We asked ourselves then, how can we bring this in to be relevant for that community and make sure that we contribute to the opposite of polarisation in society.

So, Skills for Employment was developed. We set the target for 2,400 people to be engaged in Europe. At this date, 1,700 people have actually started to work for IKEA. And we are continuing now to use whatever we learned, both for ourselves in the light of the Ukraine crisis, but also bringing along 500 other companies as an ambition to see if we can spread what we learned, the practical steps, the insights, to make it a bit of a bigger movement.

Linda Lacina: So those 1,700 folks who have been placed — what are they doing in the stores and what sort of training have they received?

Jesper Brodin: These 1,700 people, they are basically part of the store operations mostly. So, one of the obvious barriers is of course language. And language is not the barrier that you can sort of leave at the side, you have to provide training, of course. Then you can say the basic skills of the work is the second step of the training.

The training goes both ways. So, it's also about how is the receiving unit supporting people who might be the most intelligent, motivated people, on this planet? How do you get readiness into your community to actually help them get started in a good way? So, these are some of the modules that we are applying.

Linda Lacina: And as you have scaled this programme, how has it been modified to adapt to other companies’ needs and the needs of other refugee communities?

Jesper Brodin: There are a couple of practical things, and it goes almost for everybody, but there are two insights or learnings, along the way. The level of motivation for people who have basically left their roots, left their comfort, their families, their history behind. People are desperate to find and place their new roots in a new society. And not having a job, not being part of society, is I think one of the most dangerous things for people's confidence and then, isolation in a way. So again, the understanding of the motivational aspects and that motivation can help you overcome so much.

Secondly, I would say what we learned was that, in our ways of recruiting in the past, without being conscious about it, we would exclude people based on the lack of maybe something - language skills, some missing parts of the CVs - so, we were not very welcoming to broaden our view and gaze on people with that background. Only to find again, which I'm happy to share with any company, these 1,700: it's difficult to find more motivated people, more fast-learning people. So, I would say it adds value, of course, to us in a time where it's not always easy to recruit people, but it also adds, I think, a human, dignifying quality to our taskforce and to our workforce entirely.

Linda Lacina: There's a toolkit that the Initiative has put into place. Can you give folks an idea of how that walks and talks.

Jesper Brodin: Yeah. So, the toolkit is very practical. It's a seven-step programme. It's about readiness, it's about setting up the trainings. It is about follow-up as well. And I think the last step is important also. How do we change the narrative, then?

In the obvious practicalities of what you do, you need to, as an organization, also mind the bias, the fears that sits in your existing organization, and make sure that you not only bring along people from this background, but also focus on the people that are existing in your community to make them, if there is fears, if there are confusion, if there is maybe curiosity, how do you engage demos into the process? So, we together actually can change the narrative. For years, the whole topic of refugees, they have almost been demonised as people. So by allowing people to get to know each other, to listen to people's stories, and all work together is normally the practical way how we overcome those hinderances. That is all part of the concept that we have and a document that I share openly with anybody who's interested to try.

Linda Lacina: And as this toolkit was developed, is there anything that was surprising to you or illuminating or even deepened your understanding of this challenge?

Jesper Brodin: I would say when you look at it so often, it's very practical. It's very obvious, in a way.

When I take a bit of a helicopter view on it, we came from a perspective of humanitarian support. And I want to reflect being IKEA being for the many people in society. We wanted to reflect people as society looks like. And so maybe we came into it a bit thinking that we were doing people a favour, only to learn that again, we are the big winners, to be honest.

Again, these are times when it's not always easy to recruit. And to get this new base of talent as an asset proves to me and to us, you know, that it's both the right thing to do, but it's also the right thing to do from a business perspective. What an opportunity to have more talented people to choose from.

Linda Lacina: There have been some shifts in the labour market recently and in some sectors, there was a labour shortage, but on the other hand, there were also millions of people around the world who aren't employed, and that has gotten far less visibility.

As we talk about matching refugees with opportunities, what do you think is needed to give this challenge the same attention that has come to the Great Resignation?

Jesper Brodin: These are days I think where we need to be really humble and listen carefully to people's needs. We are still, hopefully, in the later phase of a pandemic that we haven't experienced in a hundred years. So, there are reactions and counter-reactions. We see that on the labour market, we see young people who used to maybe be attracted to move into cities and who is now freelancing and living on the countryside.

Maybe one of the movements is then, in particular, among the young wanting to define their own work style, and being maybe a little bit less career-oriented in their choices.

I would say the thing that stands out for us in IKEA and for myself also is our people seem to be more interested in looking for a company or a context which provides purpose.

We see that in all generations, but people are looking for something that is more than just a meal ticket. And this is, of course, something that puts demands on all of us as employers to how do we actually provide that in the broader context, like IKEA being foundation-based, so, you can say by nature you're part of something greater. But how do you also invite people in their work lives to actually be part of something that they find meaning from? That is incredibly important.

Then third, I think we’re still in search of what is the new work style, The discussions about working at home or working in the office, for instance, concerns a small amount of people in our communities, since most people are into the daily operations where you need to be together.

But we also see among the thousands of people in IKEA how, distancing yourself and always working on a distance, creates a new form of emptiness and a new form of loneliness, while we are looking for practical ways of working in the future. Of course, we also think the physical teamwork is an incredibly important ingredient of finding stimulation and happiness in your work life.

Linda Lacina: What do you think it will take for leaders to understand the extent of the employment problem facing displaced people?

Jesper Brodin: I think it's important for everybody to start by accepting society as it looks like. So as corporations, we have little to influence the start of diversity in our societies. But again, being part of society, you need to make sure you don't disconnect yourself, but actually welcome and embrace the sheer statistics of the world you live in.

And it's interesting to say in IKEA today, we are very far in gender diversity. We are where we should be at 50-50 on all levels. We are at equal pay. But 20 years ago, we were not, which is interesting. Which tells me also there is bias within society. There is bias within every company. Probably we'd need to admit there’s bias within each one of us. So, I think by being humble and accepting that, we will open our gates a little bit to find new opportunities.

Linda Lacina: What would the employment initiative need to scale?

Jesper Brodin: I think we need a debate in society in general. We will try to contribute from an IKEA perspective with that through the skills of employment. The last part of the seven points is about changing the narrative.

It's a human trait and it's a human behaviour, which is known by organizations like UN and so on, that people who come from a culture or a nation or a place close to yourself, you have easier to open your doors and your hearts and your arms for. People who come from far away, there is more questions, there's more fears, there are more barriers.

And this goes as much as Africans to Africans, to Swedes and Norwegians or Ukrainians moving into Europe. But we need to challenge that because, we need to make sure that we basically reflect humanistic values on any human being who is in need.

I think that requires dialogue, that requires conversation to get to know people. We need to make sure that we oppose all forces that are segregating people in society. And this is, of course, a very difficult task. But then again, I think companies have a much bigger role to play by allowing that diversity on all levels in the companies and seeing that as an asset.

Linda Lacina: You talked about the need for people to make changes on the community level. People listening to this, what's something that they can do today to engage with the people that maybe they haven't talked to enough, especially people in their own communities? What should they do?

Jesper Brodin: Walk out on the street, and maybe bring in your mind a question or something you would like to talk about and look at the strangers around you and then walk up and talk to somebody who looks the least like you and see what happens. It's something that I actually recently experienced, and with lots of interesting reactions, by the way.

But I think it's about getting to know people, getting to understand what they're made of, what they're dreaming of. Again, maybe also I think in particular for those on the call who have an opportunity to be decision makers, not over intellectualise it. Make some trials, make some tests, and see how you actually can learn and benefit from the richness of diversity.

Linda Lacina: We're looking ahead at some volatility, both on the economic and the geopolitical spectrum and all of that could worsen the refugee crisis. What impact do you think that could have on unemployment, job loss or even hope?

Jesper Brodin: Well, these days, the bandwidth of scenarios have never been broader from the optimistic positive answer to the more challenging ones.

I think probably the most challenging scenario of them all is climate change and the impact climate change will have on the refugee situation. Of course, geopolitical issues are here and now a reality, with a war ongoing in Ukraine and in so many more places. But I think climate change might be the biggest trigger of challenges in the future.

If the challenges become too big, you know, for society to handle, you will have polarisation, you will have extremism and things might happen of course. But I think to that point, I think we need to both, in society, build for a bit of resilience, engage ourselves so we can address the root causes rather than always being one step behind.

But again, the only way forward is that we need to be able as humans to show humanistic values and make sure that we can create a win-win. And again, I'm a deep believer after being close to this topic where I thought this was charity, it turned out it was for the benefit for the company.

So be a bit curious about how actually you can benefit from the situation rather than the opposite.

Linda Lacina: Those looking to contribute to these big picture issues. Is there a benefit in considering how you'll need to work differently? Maybe focusing more on the purpose that you want to move forward and being a little bit more flexible on things like timelines, that leaders might be more comfortable with.

Jesper Brodin: It's different in different cultures and how you work and how you operate. Some people are very stringent about their strategies and plans. Probably, I would guess, the best way would be to integrate your plans into the plans so it's not, something that is adverse for how you actually like to work.

But I would imagine that any company out there, small as big, works with recruitment as a strategy. All recent data points in that we are too slow. I can start by pointing at IKEA, but I know a lot of companies out there are too rigorous, too slow in their recruitment process, and too limiting to a certain stereotype of profiles.

And what happens of course from a diversity perspective is that you keep repeating and duplicating the same talent you already have. So, if you're curious to expand your intelligence in your community, you also need to change your recruitment process. And if you don't know how, at least dare to take some risks, stop asking some questions, stop looking for some CVs, or do what excellent companies like Greyston with the famous Joe Kenner is doing, basically recruiting anybody on the list who wants a job without any asked questions. That would be the most, I think, daring way of approaching it in a different way. We are copying his wisdom, and the interesting thing is it works so much better than you could ever imagine. So be a bit more open, try to recruit in a different way, I would say, and see, test and try instead of over intellectualising it.

Linda Lacina: Say we fixed this issue and we're able to, even on the refugee end, give folks meaningful employment and a new start in new communities. What does that world look like? What is that before and after?

Jesper Brodin: So now we are heading towards a beautiful world. We had some great minds the other day describe it from an energy perspective. You can be, maybe challenged in the short term, but if you look at the long term, we're headed towards a world powered by renewable energy, which will be maybe not free, but almost, and we’re headed to a world where people are in a win-win position where people basically have an opportunity to fulfil their dreams, to make a journey together on, whatever Maslow’s staircase that we will climb. The opposite would be winners and losers. And in the end of the day, in a world that is so integrated, there will be only lose if it's win-lose.

So, to continue to believe in that, yeah, we, we are here actually to win together. That I think would be a guiding star.

Linda Lacina: You said that leaders have to show their humanitarian values. How do you do that? What is a way that you put that into practice in a block and tackle way? Maybe in a meeting or just with people that you talk to and see?

Jesper Brodin: I think IKEA as a company and so on is deeply rooted into humanistic values. Interestingly enough, the key document for us is called The Testament of a Home Furnishing Dealer. It was written in 1979, I think, by our founder. And it's an interesting, a lovely document. It's available in public. It has a strong vision to create a better life for the many people. And then it has nothing. It has no strategy, no plan, no structure. And then it goes straight into values. Values like togetherness, how you give responsibility to people and many more values.

We thought, I think, and he probably thought that they were, Swedish values or rooted the community where he came from, only to find that every market, every country, every culture that we have approached, there is, a similar likeminded group of people who sympathise with those values. And even more so I would say, a modern approach to how people would like society to work.

So, I think exercising values has to be done in reality, but also interestingly enough -- which I'm not sure everybody knows -- it's the best tool to have speed in your decision making. Because in a structure where you are reliant on the top to be the smartest or even so in times of crisis like Corona or whatnot, if the culture is to get afraid of taking decisions when times are tough, you will of course lose out.

But if you build a culture where, people know the compass of your ethics and values you also breed a culture of decision making that will make you capable to take many right decisions at the same time. So, I think, it's an underestimated value actually.

Linda Lacina: Is there a book that you recommend?

Jesper Brodin: Yes, the Testament of a Home Furnishing Dealer! No — right now, I must admit I have a favourite book and now I'm very biased. We have recently actually, printed an internal IKEA book, but it's spread to 177,000 people. It's translated in I don't know how many languages, and it's actually a book where we are, I think, one of the first big companies to invite everybody in our community to be a climate ambassador.

So, it's a full disclosure of our footprint, of our plan. It's basically a complete register of what we have done, what we're doing, what we will do, including also the things where we’re stuck or where we're struggling. So, this has been over the last two weeks rolled out among all of IKEA.

And actually, it's my favourite book at this moment. And if anybody would be curious to read it, I'm sure we can sneak a copy or two out of our system.

Linda Lacina: If you had one message for leaders gathering right now, what would that be?

Jesper Brodin: Action. Action. Action. It's almost like if you're in a boat that’s sinking or leaking, at least you can say there will always be one or two who claims that the boat is not leaking.

There are only two groups of people to engage with: the ones who try to fix the problem, find it and fix it, and the other group who pumps, with all their spirits to get water out of the boat. So, I think right now it's about finding solutions both for mitigation and adaptation. We will pay the price of our naivety as humanity over the last decades, maybe centuries, of an economic model where we believed that we had a smaller impact than we in fact had. We believed that resources were endless and so forth. We are waking up to a new reality and we are in a hurry to shift into a totally different economic model. And maybe a bit of a new, you know, vision around what the world should be all about.

So, we need to be fast to share, develop solutions in order to make sure we build for that economy. And at the same time, in the coming decades, we will experience events that are related to the carbon we already have in the air. So, we also need to ready ourselves, steel ourselves and make sure there's a just transition where everyone is on board. It's a big task.

Linda Lacina: That was Jesper Brodin. Thanks so much to Jesper, and thanks so much to you for listening. A transcript of this episode and my colleagues’ episodes, Radio Davos and the Book Club podcast, is available at wef.ch/podcasts.

Our digital content team will be on the ground in Davos, and the podcast team will be recording once again from our beautiful booth in the Congress Centre.

Listen for Meet the Leaders featuring top names from the summit, and don't miss my colleague Robin Pomeroy's Daily Radio Davos episodes breaking down the can't-miss highlights from every big session and every big name.

This episode of Meet the Leader was presented and produced by me with Jere Johannson as editor and Gareth Nolan driving studio production.

That's it for now. I'm Linda Lacina with the World Economic Forum. Have a great day.

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